“Can we still afford the rich?” asked moderator Louis Klamroth on Monday in the new edition of the ARD talk “Hard but Fair”. Provocative.

A provocative man like Wolfgang Grupp fit in perfectly at the guest table. After all, the legendary entrepreneur and long-time Trigema boss from Burladingen in Baden-Württemberg is never at a loss for a crisp answer. The “Hard but Fair” editorial team certainly expected this from him.

Should rich people like Wolfgang Grupp pay more? asks Louis Klamroth

“Many people think that things are no longer fair in Germany,” was the thesis of the talk show makers. At the beginning, moderator Klamroth wanted to know from Grupp whether it bothered him that wealth was so unequally distributed in Germany.

“Whether it bothers me or not, I can’t change it anyway.” But if people are rich because they have achieved a lot, that is okay too. After all, wealth as an entrepreneur also brings with it a lot of responsibility, especially for employees.

Grupp was the owner of the textile and clothing company Trigema for 50 years – on January 1, 2024, he handed over management to his children Wolfgang jr. and Bonita and his wife Elisabeth.

Klamroth told Grupp that his fortune is estimated at at least 100 million euros – whether he feels super-rich. “I don’t see myself as poor. You know: he is rich who is satisfied with what he has.”

Grupp becomes emotional: “We need decency and justice back!”

But Grupp didn’t really want to talk about that. He had another topic that made him really emotional: “We finally need responsibility and liability back!” he said loudly.

“That as a personally liable entrepreneur I pay the same tax as everyone who is not liable…” he started and didn’t even finish the sentence, his voice cracked. That an investor like René Benko goes bankrupt, even receives state aid – and still remains a millionaire… “If that’s fair, we don’t need to talk about the rich, but about justice,” shouted Grupp, getting even louder.

“We need decency and justice back!” he demanded. “It finally has to be said!”

Tax tricks of the rich? “It would be stupid not to use it”

Later it was about tax tricks and legal loopholes that the rich in particular would take advantage of. Grupp said unequivocally that this was the fault of politicians. “That a taxpayer uses what he can use: he would be stupid if he didn’t use it.”

Grupp said he always pays all the taxes he has to pay. “I never went to Switzerland or anything like that… I would be ashamed if I said: I moved the company somewhere for tax reasons.”

And finally he came back to the topic of liability and responsibility – with this metaphor: “There used to be 26 textile factories in Burladingen. 25 went bankrupt. They all built a villa when they were doing well. But no one has the villa sold when he went bankrupt.”

When the end credits of the program were already rolling, Grupp continued to argue with Johannes Vogel, the FDP politician sitting next to him, so loudly that he couldn’t be ignored. No, there’s no other way to put it: Grupp didn’t disappoint with “Hart aber fair”.

Note: The critical statements about Burladinger textile companies are now contradicted by Wolfgang Bitzer – the son of one of the entrepreneurs mentioned by Grupp.

“I would like to contradict this by saying that my parents’ villa was sold within a few months after my father’s accidental death and the subsequent liquidation of our company (Ernst Bitzer knitwear company).

sb